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GOING TO SAY, YOU KNOW WHAT? CHICAGO HAS NO CASES OF COVID TODAY. SOLEDAD: THOSE GOING DOOR-TO-DOOR ENCOUNTER A RGEAN OF PEOPLE AT THE DOOR, FROM ETH COVID DENIERS OR JUST THE UNCERTN.AI DR. LAURA MURRAY IS A CLINICAL PSYCHOLOGIST AND A SENIOR SCIENTIST AT JOHNS HOPKINS UNIVERSITY SCHOOL OF PUBCLI HEALTH. SHE’S AN EXPERT ON BEHAVIORA HEALTHSSS. I DR. LAURA MURRAY, THANK YOU FOR JOINING ME. GIVE ME A SENSE OF WHAT’S DRIVING THAT 40% OF PEOPLE WHO ARE JUST NOT VACCINATED AND DON’T SEEM TO WANT TO BE VACCINATED DR. MURRAY: SO, WE’RE HEARING NOT ENOUGH INFORMATION, WORRIES ABOUT POSSIBLE SIDE EFFECTS, DISTRUSTN IGOVERNMENT TO MAKE SURE THAT VACCINES ARE SAFE AND EFFECTIV POLITICS HAVE PLAYED A ROLE. THE BELIEF THAT THE RISK OF COVID MAY BE EXAGGEREDAT IS SOMETHING WE’RE HEARING. SOLEDAD: THIS IDEA, LIKEI, DON’T KNOW ENOUGH ABOUT THE VACCINE. WHERE DOES THAT COME FROM? IS THAT MISINFORMATION? DR. MURRAY: IN GENERAL, TSEHO THAT ARE HESITANT HAVE A PSYCHOLOGICAL VARIABLE THAT HAS A LOWER LEVEL OF TRUSTN I SCIENTISTS, HEALTH CARE PROFESSIONALS AND STATE LIKELY, NOT SURPRISING. THEY TEND TO HAVE LOWER LELSVE SOFOMETHING WE CALL COGNITIVE REFLECTION OR JUST LOWER LEVELS OF THINKING THROH UGSOMETHING VERY CAREFULLY. THEY TEND TO HAVE LOWER LEVELS OF ALTRUISM. CONSPIRATORIAL THINKINISG ANOTHER PREDICTOR OF VACCINE HETASINCY. WE’RE SEEING A PSYCHOLOGICAL VARIABLE WHERE THESE FOLKS ARE HAVING HIGHER LEVELS OF AN INTERNAL LOCUS OF CONTROL. AND WHAT THAT MEANS IS THEY LIKE TO HAVE MORE CONTROL, WHICH MAY GUIDE THE NEED TO HA MVEORE OF THAT INFORMATION. SOLEDAD: KNOWING ALL OF THAT THEN AND KNOWINGHE PSYCHOLOGICAL PROFILE, HOW DO YOU USE THAT TO GET THAT0% 4 VACCINATED? DR. MURRAY: ONE OF THE THINGS WE TALK ABOUT WHILE WORKINGN O HUMAN BEHAVIOR CHANGE IS TAKGIN SOME OF THE EMOTION OUT OF IT, AND THIS IS SO MUCH EASIER SAID THAN DONE BECAUSE A LOT OFS U WHO ARE REACHING OUT FEEAL CERTAIN WAY OUELRSVES. ANOTHER SOLUTION IS TO ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS. WHAT WOULD THESE PEOPLE NEED TO KNOW TO CONSIDER THE VACNECI RATHER THAN JUST FEEDING WHAT WE MIGHT COME UP WITH? WE KNOW THAT MESSAGING IS OFTEN BEST WHEN IT’S SOMEONE WHO’S TRUSTED. AND I KNOW DIFFERE CNTOMMUNITIES AND GOVERNMENTS ARE USING SOCIAL INFLUENCERS OR COMMUNITY LEADERS TO REACH THOSE THAT ARE VACCINE HESITANT AT A NEIGHBHOOROD LEL.VE RESEARCH SHOWS THAT POSITIVE EMOTIONAL MESSAGES SUCH AS ALTRUISM AND HOPE ARE ACTUALLY MORE EFFECTIVE THAN NEGATIVE ONES OR FORCING PEOPLE. AND, SOLEDAD, YOU BROUGHT UP FOR THOSE THAT ARE STRONGLY OPPODSE TO VACCINES JUST BASED ON EMOTION OR IDEOLOGY, MORALS, IT’S VERY, VERY CHALLENGINGO T OVERRIDE THEM WITH FACTSND A INFORMATION, JUST FROM A HUMAN BEHAVIOR CHANGE PERSPECTIVE. SO, WE REALLY NEED TO WO ONRK DIFFERENT MESSAGING FOR THEES GROUPS, MAYBE ALMOST CHARACTERIZE IT AS A RIGHTR O PRIVILEGE THAT THEY SHOULDN'’ LET OTHERS TAKE AWAY FROM TH.EM SOLEDAD: DR. LAURA MURRAY WITH JOHNS HOPKINS UNIVERSITY, TH